Cure for criminal insanity discovered!!!
Friday, March 6th, 2009
We must assume that such a cure has been found.
Vince Li (the nut who decapitated an innocent passenger on a bus) was found to be not criminally responsible for his act due to insanity the other day. It is hardly unexpected that Li was determined to be a lunatic. A person does not exactly need their doctorate in psychology in order to conclude that Vince Li was crazy. Of course, how many people who commit murder have all of their marbles rolling around correctly anyway?
I do not believe in a vengeful justice system. As horrific as the murder that Li committed was, I am not one of those calling for his execution or a lifetime of daily torture in a deep hole. What I do believe though is that the protection of the public must be paramount!
While some people are expressing shock and rage with Li’s being found not responsible, the usual hug-a-thug crowd is quick to come in and point out that Li will likely never be released back into the public. That would indeed be comforting if indeed there was any reason to believe it. Unfortunately that is nowhere near the truth in Canada’s “justice” system.
The media did not need to dig too deeply to find a local example of an insane murder released among us with a paltry amount of time served in a nuthouse.
Steven Gaeten Lee (the clearly remorseful man pictured above) murdered Steven Tavares in a Kananaskis hotel room in 2004. Tavares’ body was found to be viciously perforated by 28 stab wounds.
Well, Lee was found to be not criminally responsible due to being insane. We were assured that he would be in an institution for a very long time.
Steven Gaeten Lee was released last May!
Perhaps I am being simplistic, but would it not take a little more than three years to confidently “cure” a man who is capable of committing such an act?
We must assume that he has been cured. The institution would never have released him otherwise right? I must have missed the headlines when this cure for insanity was discovered. Criminal insanity has plagued humanity for centuries, one would think that the cure for such a condition would have been trumpeted far and wide. Sorry folks, there is no way that a person who can commit acts as Li and Lee did could ever be considered safe and stable.
Obsessive compulsive disorders take years of treatment to bring under control (they are never cured), how the hell is murderous rampaging exactly cured?
Li is a young man and we can rest assured that his crazy and dangerous ass will be walking Canada’s streets again.
The benefit of the doubt is given to these killers far too often and the public is paying the price. Just ask the families of the victims that Gingras killed when on a three day rampage after being released from an Edmonton institution.
The safety of the public must come before giving the benefit of the doubt to these nuts.
Evidence of Knowledge of Wrongfulness
1) Efforts to avoid detection
- wearing gloves during crime
- waiting until dark
- taking victim to an isolated place
- wearing mask or disguise
- concealment of a weapon on way to crime
- falsifying documents (passport, firearm permit)
- giving a false name
- threatening to kill witnesses if they report to police
- giving a false alibi
2) Disposing of evidence
- wiping off fingerprints
- washing off blood
- discarding of murder weapon
- burying a murder victim secretly
- destroying incriminating documents
3) Efforts to avoid detection
- fleeing from the crime scene
- fleeing from the police
- lying to the police
4)Statement by the defendant that he or she knew the act was wrong at the time of the offense
5) Notifying the police that a crime was committed
6) Expression of remorse or guilt after the crime committed
7) Absence of hallucinations or delusions suggesting that the offense was justified
Who is Dr Stanley Yaren? I need to state first and foremost that the views expressed in this post may not be shared by others. I am of the opinion that the crown prosecutor never fulfilled their legal duty to the people they represent. I am also of the opinion that the taxpayers were double billed for this trial. The taxpayers should not be burdened with a requirement to pay for the defence lawyers nor was there any need for a witnesses for the defence. This was a waste of taxpayer’s money … Defence lawyer 101 … if the prosecution has not proven their case… you make a motion to quash the charge. If they have proven your case… sit back and smile.
Dr Stanley Yaren was called by the crown as their star witness…. actually, their only witness.
Dr. Stanley Yaren described Li as a “decent person” who was clearly out of his mind when he believed he was acting on God’s orders to eliminate “the force of evil” and attacked Tim McLean.
Yaren said Li has made significant strides since being hospitalized after his arrest and could one day function again in the community — something Yaren admits doesn’t sit well with most people, including the victim’s family.
“I completely understand the need for a sense of justice, of retribution,” Yaren told Queen’s Bench Justice John Scurfield.
“But (Li) is as much of a victim of this horrible illness … as Mr. McLean is a victim. Don’t hate the person. Hate the illness.”
Yaren tells court he saw Li nineteen times, for a total of 12 hours. Who is Stanley Yaren… Doctor Stanley Yaren is Manitoba’s chief forensic psychiatrist… He has testified at other hearings… Although I have marked in bold some statements, you can formulate your own opinion!
R. v. Lowes: Between Her Majesty the Queen, informant, and Kirk Lowes, accused
 M.J. No. 549 Manitoba Provincial Court
Briefly summarized: The accused has pleaded guilty to an information charging him with the offence of distributing child pornography, contrary to Section 163.1(3)(a) of the Criminal Code. The Crown having proceeded by indictment, the maximum punishment is incarceration for a term not exceeding ten years.
Dr Stanley Yaren report for this case:
The psychiatric report prepared by Dr. Stanley Yaren, Psychiatrist, Health Sciences Centre, PsychHeath Centre, dated April 16, 1997 (contained in Exhibit 51):
“The reason for this assessment was explained to Mr. Lowes. He understood that our conversation was not confidential as I would be preparing this report for your use. He was completely cooperative, open and spontaneous throughout the assessment procedure. Mr. Lowes is facing charges in connection with distributing child pornography over the Internet. Mr. Lowes readily acknowledges and admits to the actions which led to the charges against him. He also acknowledges the wrongfulness and immorality of his behaviour. Based upon this assessment it is my opinion that Mr. Lowes’ involvement in the offending behaviour was not intentionally malicious was not done either for personal sexual gratification or for financial gain. Mr. Lowes first developed an interest in the Internet in December of 1996 at which time his home computer became connected to the Internet through a commercial Internet service provider. Mr. Lowes’ interest rapidly progressed to a fascination and then later an obsession. He started spending all of his spare time in front of the computer attempting to master the technology of the Internet. This type of experience was not new for Mr. Lowes or for his wife, as it was his usual practice when he was becoming involved in and learning about something new to totally immerse himself in it. Mr. Lowes eventually mastered the techniques of searching the Internet and discovered News Groups where he was able to access sexually explicit material of all kinds. He admits that initially he was somewhat titillated by the erotic material (but not the pedophiliac material). He states that the novelty soon wore off and the content became boring. He then became interested in exploring more deviant material. He derived excitement from the sense that he was exploring and accessing things that are usually forbidden. He viewed this more as a technical challenge than as something he was doing for sexual gratification. As I understand it he explored a number of areas of deviant sexuality not only pedophilia. Eventually Mr. Lowes sought to increase his technical skills and mastery as well as his exploration of the forbidden by getting into the process of exchanging pictures by electronic mail. Apparently Mr. Lowes was unaware of the fact that there are relatively simple techniques which can be used to exchange E-mail without having it traced back to the individual. Mr. Lowes appears to have been experimenting without giving much thought to the implications of his actions. Mr. Lowes states that by the time he was charged with the offences his interest in the Internet had already begun to wane and it had been several weeks since he had accessed or exchanged any of the pornographic material. He states that he was in the process of deleting the material from his computer hard drive as the pictures were using up all of his storage space. Mr. Lowes is 27 years old. He has no past history of mental disorder and no criminal record. He has been married for the past 2 1/2 years to a woman who he has known for the past 14 years. They are expecting their first child later this year. Mr. Lowes has some university education. He is steadily employed on a full-time basis in a semi-skilled job with a cable manufacturing company. Previously he has worked as a salesman. Mr. Lowes is a moderate drinker and he does not use illicit drugs. He is in good physical health . . . . .
Mr. Lowes indicates that he does not experience any deviant sexual arousal. He indicated that he worked in one of the first adult video stores in Winnipeg. Initially he found this job quite sexually exciting but he rapidly discovered that continuous exposure to explicit sexual material was boring, monotonous and he soon lost interest. It is interesting to note that this earlier experience seems to have been repeated in his more recent exposure to explicit material over the Internet. It appears that when he became bored with this material he pursued more deviant and forbidden material as a way of stimulating his interest. Mr. Lowes indicated that he and his wife are quite compatible sexually and that he does not experience any need for involvement in deviant sexual fantasies or practice. There is nothing based upon my examination to indicate that Mr. Lowes suffers from pedophilia or any other paraphilic disorder . . . . . I would not classify Mr. Lowes’ level of involvement in the Internet as a true addiction. I do not consider his interest in child pornography to be a manifestation of a pedophilic disorder. I do not identify any other mental disorder or condition requiring treatment or psychological intervention.”
end of report
Sounds like Kirk Lowes would also be a fine upstanding citizen who according to Mr Stanley Yaren, should be allowed to work at your local daycare.. thanks, but no thank… Kirk Lowes can watch your kids!
Li was not convicted of any crime. Based on the testimony of this Dr Stanley Yaren, the judge was forced to make a judgement based on the evidence presented. Had the judge been presented with evidence allowing him to convict the defendant, there would have been minimum sentencing guidelines that would have been imposed. But the judge was presented with Stanley Yaren’s professional opinion. Like the opinion I just shared…. This is why we need Tim’s Law.
We are looking for donations to offset the cost of getting the transcript of Dr Stanley Yaren testimony at the Li trial. Information on donating to the Tim’s Law effort can be found under the contact info at the top of the homepage.
It’s pretty obvious we need new laws governing those found not criminally responsible for serious, violent offences, including murder.
The story of Vince Li, who stabbed, beheaded and mutilated carnival worker Tim McLean last year just outside of Portage la Prairie, is a perfect example.
I know all the do-gooders and the highbrow crowd think putting a guy like Li away for the rest of his life is inhumane and uncivilized.
They trot out all the psychiatric statistics and justifications for why we shouldn’t keep severely psychotic people like Li in secure custody forever.
NOT REALLY CRIMINALS
They’re not really criminals. They didn’t really commit the offence, the illness did. And they should be given a chance to reintegrate. Yeah, we get it.
But for those of us who place greater weight on public safety, we say keeping Li off the streets forever is just common sense.
I keep hearing this argument that most people deemed not criminally responsible after killing someone don’t kill again after they’re released into the community.
Therefore, they don’t need to be locked up forever, the argument goes.
Well, the same could be applied to people who are found criminally responsible for homicide. Most of those don’t kill again either, most studies show. But we still hand out life sentences for first and second-degree murder.
I don’t see why under the Criminal Code we can’t sentence people deemed not criminally responsible for serious, violent offences to life in a secure facility.
Instead of a prison, a court would sentence them to a secure mental-health facility.
It would be humane, civilized and the right setting for people with severe mental health illnesses.
The reality is, there are all kinds of complicated reasons why people commit offences. Some people are controlled by their addictions, serious psychological afflictions from years of abuse and neglect, fetal alcohol syndrome, mental health issues not serious enough to warrant institutionalization, you name it.
Are those people responsible for their crimes? Did they know what they were doing? Did they know it was wrong?
Yes, no, maybe.
At some point did Vince Li know what he was doing was wrong when he dismembered Tim McLean? Did he have a lucid moment?
Not even Dr.Stanley Yaren, the forensic psychiatrists who testified at his trial could say for sure.
If we’re going to allow someone like Vince Li back on the street because he has a serious mental disorder, should we let the person with FAS convicted of second- degree murder out, too?
If not, why not? No doubt a bunch of high-priced lawyers and forensic psychiatrists could make a case for why the FAS offender shouldn’t be held responsible for his actions because he didn’t know what he was doing was wrong.
After all, it wasn’t his fault his mother drank during pregnancy.
No, we shouldn’t let the FAS killer out. We shouldn’t let the crack-addicted killer out. And we shouldn’t let Vince Li out.
All for the same reason: public safety. Put them in the right institution. Treat them humanely. Give them the treatment they require. Whatever.
But for goodness sake, don’t let them back on the street.
For excerpts of the agreed statement of facts in the Vince Li case, visit Brodbeck’s blog Raise a Little Hell at winnipegsun.com.
News Columnists / Tom Brodbeck
Vince Li has been found not criminally responsible for the gruesome murder and beheading of Tim McLean on a Greyhound bus last summer because he is mentally ill.
Both the Crown and the defence agreed that Li is a schizophrenic who was suffering from a psychotic episode when he killed the 22-year-old McLean.
Li, 40, will now be remanded to a secure psychiatric facility where he will receive treatment. A review panel will decide in the next six weeks which facility he will be transferred to.
Ladies and Gentlemen, I want to begin with a warning. The commentary I am about to offer you has graphic details that you may not want to expose your children to. They concern a hideous event that took place on a bus near Portage La Prairie, Manitoba. Today, a judge ruled on whether the man with the knife was criminally responsible. The ruling was a foregone conclusion, since this was a trial where the defence and prosecution were on the same page, both telling the judge that the defendant was NOT guilty legally, NOT criminally responsible for his actions. And today Justice John Scurfield, having no legal choice in the matter, acted lawfully when he ruled that Vincent Li was not criminally responsible. Li is being sent to an institution where he will receive treatment and assessed annually and some day a team of psychiatrists may decide that Vincent Li is ready to resume his life as a free man. For many people that is the end of the trail. For the victim’s mother, she wants a law passed, Tim’s law, that says if you are found NOT criminally responsible after having killed somebody, where there is no doubt who did the killing, that if you are committed to a mental facility, that you go there for life. I AGREE with her.
I know that the overwhelming majority of you agree with her. But there are times in this country where we are told by people with far more power than they deserve to have, that the MAJORITY is savagely ignorant, caring only about low rent emotions like revenge, and should be kept as far away as possible from decisions like this.
As a country we are being asked to accept the idea that if a man is suffering from a mental illness when committing the most hideous of crimes, then we must park our desire for punishment, we must avoid our feelings for the family of the victim, we must focus on one thing and one thing only and that is the current mindset and current ideology of Canada’s Psychiatric Community, who individually are for the most part, good and decent people, but collectively on some issues are not necessarily the country’s most reliable friends.
There are also many people in this country suffering from mental illness. Their families and friends are suffering with them. And many of them OVER-IDENTIFY with Vincent Li. Many of them say if the Majority of Canadians have a beef with this decision, they have a beef with all people who are suffering with mental illness, and if they think that someone who is suffering should be sent to an institution with no hope of ever getting out, the slippery slope is being created for all people suffering. This is where Canadians have to put up the stop sign and say, “I am sorry to inform you, that this is not about you or a member of your family. This is about someone who killed a young man and then proceeded to eat his kill.” And while many people are suffering from mental illness and deserve compassion and treatment, they are not all VINCENT LI and we’re not creating a more just and rational Canada by over-identifying with him. We are creating precisely the opposite.
I want to take you to the event in question by reading in a very straight forward way, the story that was filed by the Canadian Press earlier this week and appeared on news sites and newspapers all over the world.
The man who beheaded a passenger on a Greyhound bus was a victim himself, tormented by the voice of God telling him to do it, a forensic psychiatrist told Vince Li’s second-degree murder trial.
The voice told Li to use an assumed name and get on the bus traveling from Edmonton to Thunder Bay last July, Dr. Stanley Yaren said on the first day of Li’s trial.
Li chose to sit next to Tim McLean because McLean made a “friendly gesture’’ to him, Yaren said.
As the bus neared Portage la Prairie, Man., around 8:30 p.m., 40-year-old Li started hearing voices.
“A voice from God told him Mr. McLean was a force of evil and was about to execute him,’’ Yaren told the judge hearing the case.
“He had to act fast to protect himself. In response to that, in a state of panic and fearful for his life, he carried out the acts that he did.’’
Killing McLean wasn’t enough, Yaren said.
Li, whom Yaren diagnosed as schizophrenic, believed 22-year-old McLean was capable of coming back to life, so he continued to mutilate the body and scattered the parts around the bus, the psychiatrist testified.
Although he admitted his guilt to officers that night, Li pleaded not guilty yesterday. His lawyers are arguing he is not criminally responsible because he is mentally ill. (more…)